My JW Mom died of cancer at 57....I think if I were you I'd go back there for another visit in person before it's too late. You may be glad for the rest of your life that you did.
Pete Zahut
JoinedPosts by Pete Zahut
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28
"Are you the plumber?"
by Jourles ini've been debating whether or not to post this story simply because the org knows who i am (post history from pre-'05 will tell you all you need to know), and i'm not sure if they would give my parents shit if they knew what transpired earlier this summer.
but you know what, i don't care what they do, because my mom is dying of stage iv cancer and i feel this needs to be heard by anyone struggling with the loss of contact from their relatives.. for those who are not familiar with my background, i became a small thorn in the side of the wts while i was still in.
i'm not big on being deceived, and for me, the org crossed my personal 'red line' when it came to blood and the child abuse issue.
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70
The Reasons for Cart Witnessing
by Simon inwhatever we think of it, you have to admit that it's quite "genius".. the door to door ministry as done in western developed countries where the jw quirky religion has probably reached their saturation level was a complete and utter waste of time in terms of the effort expended to recruit people.. at the same time, it was rarely something that anyone enjoyed which led to people being labelled as inactive, being pressured to doing more and maybe ultimately deciding jwism wasn't for them and leaving.. there was also the issue that many jws are actually pretty bad at knowing and articulating their beliefs so were pretty incapable of getting any meaningful message across.. they solved all this with the cart witnessing.
the real point isn't to recruit, it's to make life easier for jws.
now they can stand and chat with their friend, have a coffee, not talk to anyone or make eye contact and still act as a walking billboard for jw.org.
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Pete Zahut
I was in the City a few weeks ago with a non JW friend whom I had shared my JW past with. At one point, I even explained to him what cognitive dissonnance is and how it comes in to play with the JW's.
We passed a literature cart on the busy sidewalk and I explained to him what it was. He thought it was odd and said, " I would NEVER intentionally go up to anyone peddling religious literature".
A few blocks later we passed 2 other carts side by side on the sidewalk near the elevated train station and they were manned by four Sisters and there was a Brother standing nearby. The Brother (Joe) recognized me and came dashing over. He was an old friend who attends the same congregation I did, out in the suburbs about 30 miles away. Joe gave me a hug and seemed glad to see me even though he knows I'm not a JW anymore. I introduced him to my friend and the Joe began telling us excitedly about how successfull the cart work has been and how much positiveresponse they've been getting.
Me: " Remember back in the day when we did street witnessing in the city and we actually had to have a presentation prepared and had to seek people out? I remember we used to place stacks of magazines".
Joe: ( wistfully said ) "Yeah....I used to bring all of my old magazines and by the end of the morning they'd all be gone. Now we rarely have anyone take anything. I remember one time back in the 80's we were working on the sidewalk and there was a gay bath house nearby. One of them came out and said something derogatory like " You guys are wasting your time, no one wants to hear about your religion ".
Joe: (looking at my friend) " JW's don't look down on Gays or hold anything against them so instead of disagreeing I told him to have a nice day" .
Me: ( looking at my friend, said jokingly) "They don't have anything against Gay people unless of course the Gay person is their own kid or someone in their congregation " Ha Ha !. The sisters who were listening in, looked away when I glanced at them and smiled.
Joe: (chuckled and continued nervously) "Anyway, a few minutes later, this gay guy came back and appologized for being so rude to me. We made a good Witness just by being there".
After a bit more chit chat with Joe, my friend and I went on on our way. Once we were out of earshod my friend said:
Friend: " So did I hear correctly? First Joe said that they were having a lot of success with the literature carts, then he said that they rarely have anyone take a piece of literature.
Me: You've just seen an example of the cognitive dissonannce JW's have to employ to keep themselves going. On some level he knows he's wasting his time. but his first reaction is to deny what he really feels and say what he's expected to say. Also,If JW's didn't have a problem with Gay people, he wouldn't have felt it necessary to mention this to you but he knows that they really do have a problem with it and the cognitive dissonnance forced him to cover it up.
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17
'Serving where the need is greater' - who does it benefit?
by eyeslice2 inwe have recently been in asia on vacation, travelling to a number of countries in this part of the world.
whilst in thailand, my wife, totally pimo, wanted to go to the english speaking convention in bangkok.
although i haven't been active for a very long time, i went along with her.. the first thing that slightly surprised me was the attendance, well over 900. i hadn't expected that many but they were from all over the country, which is a pretty big place.
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Pete Zahut
We used to jokingly call it "Serving Where the Need is More Fun" because everyone who didi it was typically young and single and they always went where there were sunny beaches to be had.. No one ever went to Nome Alaska for instance. They were often young sisters just out of high school who weren't going to college and or didn't want to get a real job. They got to get away from realitiy and were given Kudos from their peers at the same time.
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Just a Rant .......
by LOLS inhi beautiful people ..... so today is my wedding anniversary ....... .
and first of all my dear husband forgot again .... which is normal according to my dear old dad "it's a man thing " .
but to add insult to injury , i must wait till friday to be taken out for dinner , because low & behold my jdub husband can't miss one bloody jw meeting !
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Pete Zahut
And first of all my dear Husband forgot again .... which is normal according to my Dear old Dad "It's a Man Thing "
But to add insult to injury , I must wait till Friday to be taken out for Dinner , because low & behold my Jdub husband can't miss one bloody JW meeting !I understand your annoyance and frustration but then again, it's nearly 2019, part of me wonders why are you waiting to be taken out for dinner? I thought we were supposed to throw out those old rules and notions about women waiting around for men to call the shots. It's nice when it happens but who said anyone has to celebrate their anniversary anyway? Probably the same person who said a man is expected to purchase a woman a diamond ring that is twice his monthly salary.
I know you're probably blowing off a little steam here. After all you do refer to your husband as "dear" but still, I wouldn't let this get to the point where celebrating your anniversary becomes an obligation rather than a happy occasion. Try not to take his forgetfulness too personally. If you and the kids make a fuss over your anniversary and do something special for him as well, he may strive to make a point of doing the same for you next year. -
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Two witness rule: who cares?
by _Morpheus ini find people railing against the so called “two witness rule” puzzling.
i think its a complete and total non issue.
for those that protest, argue or advocate for change in that rule, why?
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Pete Zahut
@pete, the op was in response to something posted on another thread. Its a bit “on the nose” only because its a continuation of another discussion. I did not want to derail or be accused of derailing the other topic."Yes we called the police. I made sure of it. I still don't see what this has to do with addressing real change".
Because the 2 witness rule is "all of a piece" "part and parcel" of a multifaceted issue and it has served as a place to start addressing the problem.
For a people (JW's) who are willing to let themselves or their little children die in a modern hospital for want of a pint of blood based on a skewed interpretation of an ancient text, the seemingly minor two witness rule could and often did influence their decision to go to the authorities when needed. We all know it's a ridiculous rule that should be ignored but evidently it all too often wasn't ignored, in congregations all over the world.Many JW's aren't even aware that there is/was a child abuse problem in their organization let alone know about the use of the 2 witness rule in such cases. Any attention drawn to it is well worth the effort.
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Two witness rule: who cares?
by _Morpheus ini find people railing against the so called “two witness rule” puzzling.
i think its a complete and total non issue.
for those that protest, argue or advocate for change in that rule, why?
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Pete Zahut
I have to say, the original question posed at the outset of this post seems just a bit too clueless and on the nose to be considered genuine. It seems almost Troll-ish and reminds me of the way some folks (who have nothing else to offer at the moment) make posts intended to stir the pot and then they sit back and enjoy the attention it garners them.
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Faders Needing a Great One Liner
by Solzhenitsyn inso our family fade is well under way.
we changed congregations as regular attenders and left in good standing with those giving hugs and kisses simply knowing we "needed a change".
we moved to a neighboring congregation that is out of our original region knowing we would see no one and the two boe's wouldn't really have immediate dealings.
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Pete Zahut
I know their "but Lord where shall we go" mentality. Part of me feels like I know their countermeasures and they don't stand a chance.
John 6:68 Lord, to WHOM shall we go? You have the sayings of everlasting life.
JW's like to say "WHERE" shall we go? " indicating that there is no other place or organization for them to turn to. The actual question was, "To WHOM shall we go? indicating that being associated with Jesus was the issue rather than with a certain organization. Individuals can still be associated with Jesus, without being JW's.
But my family and I (including an elementary school age child) would like to settle on a great one liner when approached by JW's who have been our friends for many years.
Q.) What's going on with you? Are you still attending meetings ?
A.) Without going into a lot of detail, I'll say that for us, there was a perfect storm of personal and organizational events that made us reexamine our long held religious beliefs and it was during that reexamination that we came across information regarding the organization and it's practices as well as the history of its doctrinal changes. Things that every JW should know before being baptized.
Q.) Like what?
A.) Again, I'm not going to go in to detail, but for anyone making any type of important life decision, all of the information they need to make an informed choice is now available to them so that unlike us, they're able to know what they need to know, up front.
For us,once we knew better, we did better.
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My fade. Phase 2.
by Beth Sarim inabout to move from ''irregular'' status to ''inactive''.. after 6 months of not handing a field service report since the end of june, i will be recognized as ''inactive''.
there could be 'questions' coming my way.. after having read ''crisis of conscience'' last spring, i could no longer ''actively'' preach or believe the wbts conscientiously.
i could no longer fake hours by putting the 'slip' in the field service box.
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Pete Zahut
Beth Sarim
I realize 'questions' will be coming my way. It's just phase 2, of my ''fade''. Because they recognize ''inactive'' ones as disfellowshipped and have expanded the shunning.
If and when they do question you, be as vague as possible and convey to them the idea that you are puzzled as to why they would be at all concerned about your spirituality. Neither confirm or deny anything they might have to say about you.
Be like the British royal family was way back in the day and who for the most part still seem to realize that when it comes to the public, fault will be found no matter what they say or do, so they generally offer no excuses, no explanations and no apologies.
No matter how loving and fair they appear to be, people are people and there's a certain pecking order or gang mentality that takes place as a result of the merest bit of perceived authority or advantage that they might seem to have over you, even with so called spiritual men. As soon as you start answering their questions, they'll feel empowered and will have the upper hand which could put you on the run so to speak. On the other hand, they won't know what to do with someone who doesn't play along with the game that they were prepared to play.
Get used to long pauses and quizzical looks from them. Don't be temped to rush in and fill the void with an excuse or an explanation regarding something that's your personal business.
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My Gay XJW Friend's Decision Concerning His Relationship With His Partner
by fulltimestudent ini've often spoken of my xjw friend and his younger chinese partner.
my friend was kicked out of yhwh's "clean" organisation when he was around 60. .
before he became a witness at around age 17-18, he did appreciate that he was attracted to other guys.
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Pete Zahut
fulltimestudent "They entered into a relationship at a time when my friend was a youngish 60 and his new partner was a mature 28.They have had about 30 years together and have helped each other to prosper through those years. Now my friend is in his early 80s and his partner is close to 60."
Wouldn't your friend be 90 by now? Anyway, I'm curious how you came to know so much about this situation and are they asking you for your advice in terms of what they should do? Since it was mentioned, is it significant to the story that the two younger men are Chinese?
Either way, there are certain situations in life such as May/December marriages/partnerships that are rife with these kinds of problems and that's why they often are heavily advised against. Often the issues that inevitably arise in these relationships and in life in general, don't have a good solution or any solution at all. The only thing one can do is forget finding the perfect answer and choose a way to go that seems to be the least problematic and just muddle through the best one can.
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Sentinel Island: Rewards for Those Who Expand Their Ministry, Blessings Await You!!!!!
by moomanchu in"can you serve where the need for kingdom publishers is greater?".
https://www.cnn.com/2018/11/22/asia/north-sentinel-island-worlds-isolated-tribes-intl/index.html.
the message of jehovah’s kingdom by christ has already gained grand triumphs throughout the earth because he backs up and blesses the preaching of this “good news” by his witnesses in all the inhabited earth.
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Pete Zahut
If now I had to leave Europe for some reason, I would prefer to live in India rather than in the United States.
Hopefully you realize on some level that you can't base your view of an etire country based upon what you hear in the news. From the tone of you comment, It's a wonder any of the 325 million plus U.S. residents could even survive the perceived conception you have of the place, let alone hope to have a normal existence .
Either way, there are many or the barely survivin U.S. residents if when asked, would prefer that you would in fact go to safe, clean and trouble free Inda once you've inevetably grown disenchanted with our current residence and its countrymen.
(Then again, they might be able to use you to sheild themselves from the barrage of bullets they face on a daily basis).